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 Hoiw important is 'Corporate Support and Promotion'?

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Kazadvorn
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PostSubject: Hoiw important is 'Corporate Support and Promotion'?   Sat May 10, 2014 9:29 am

Over on the WotC site forum, there was some dismal reporting on 4e at Origins.

Apparently, there are only 4 'slots' for 4e at the Con. There's actually more openings for AD&D and 2nd ed. And of course, Pathfinder rules the roost with over 100 slots for PF play.

Now, I'm not a frequent convention attendee, and have never involved myself in the actual 'organization' of a convention... so I don't really understand how events get booked and promoted, etc.

However, I have to assume that corporate sponsorship plays a significant role in determining the 'presence' of a game system at a convention. It's hard to accept that the actual interest in 4e is represented by '4' slots in a con where even 2nd ed has 16.
There has been some suggestion that WotC is actually discouraging Origins from promoting 4e.

What's the consensus? Is that the actual level of market participation in the system? Is it for all intents and purposes a lost cause?



Here are the Original event totals grouped by system. It supports my theory that 3e is very strong and not just Pathfinder. I also combined like items like Pathfinder and Pathfinder Society.

Game / Rules / System Count
Pathfinder Society 204
Shadowrun 76
Call of Cthulhu 65
D&D 3.5e 47
Savage Worlds 32
Star Wars d6 30
7th Sea 23
Arcanis Roleplaying Game 23
Various 20
HackMaster 17
D&D 2e 16
Mutants & Masterminds 16
Universal Horizons (Beta) 16
WitchHunter 16
Cold Steel Wardens: Roleplaying in the Iron Age of Comics 15
Reality A 12
Ubiquity 12
Golden Hour 11
Fate 10
Kobolds Ate My Baby! In Colour!!! 9
Twilight:2000 V.1 Mod 9
Baker Street First Edition 8
Doctor Who AITAS 8
Cortex Plus 7
QAGS 7
Dread 6
Dungeon Crawl Classics Role Playing Game 6
Homebrew 6
World of Darkness 6
Dresden Files RPG 5
Icons 5
Ironclaw 5
AD&D 1e 5
Arcanorum 4
Clockwork: Dominion 4
D&D 4e 4
d100 4
Dungeonslayers 4
Fiasco 4
Hero 4
Hero System 4
Hollow Earth Expedition 4
Mongoose Traveller 4
Rotted Capes 4
Serenity 4
Star Wars d20 4
Ubiquity -Holllow Earth Expedition 4
Wushu Open Reloaded 4

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Chris24601
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PostSubject: Re: Hoiw important is 'Corporate Support and Promotion'?   Sat May 10, 2014 2:58 pm

A lot of this has to do with why people who come to play (versus coming to shop or show off their cosplay skills) attend conventions... which can basically be boiled down to they're here to get something they can't get elsewhere... be it playing in the latest official adventures (for supported products like all those Pathfinder events) or to play a system they don't normally get to (for no longer supported products like d6 Star Wars or the older editions of D&D).

What thise numbers tell me is that 4E is played often enough at home that very few people feel the need to run a special event at a con for it (I suspect the same is true for 1e D&D) or that the system is such that the con environment isn't a good fit for it (such as the World of Darkness... a system where playing some random pre-gen sorta defeats the purpose and I'd bet virtually all those events for them are LARPs).

I'd be far more concerned about 4e's condition if it had as many events as the d6 Star Wars or 3.5e D&D. One is a game that's been defunct for more than two decades and the second is one where the lion's share jumped ship to Pathfinder. Big conventions are often the only place you can even find those games being played outside of isolated niches.

Ironically, a lack of convention presence at this point in 4e's life cycle indicates the game is still generally popular and unless Next/5e is a completr bomb I'd expect the 4e slot numbers to slowly increase over the next couple years as home campaigns wind down and it gets harder to find a local 4e game to play in.
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PostSubject: Re: Hoiw important is 'Corporate Support and Promotion'?   Sat May 10, 2014 7:21 pm

As much as I like Paizo as a company I'm utterly sick of seeing Pathfinder being at the top of things. It's getting old...

But I do agree with Chris. Most people that go to conventions and run games typically run games that aren't played as much. Most RPG fans that I've found are completely content playing their games at home.


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PostSubject: Re: Hoiw important is 'Corporate Support and Promotion'?   Sat May 10, 2014 9:21 pm

Speaking personally I'm not even planning on attending any conventions this year because I've got more than enough games locally to keep me occupied.

The only thing that ever got me to a convention were the Arcanis LARPs and Battle Interactives (200 players in the same hall fighting different chunks of a huge battle simultaneously) and to run the latest Living Arcanis mods so I wouldn't have to burn them when I inevitably got roped into running them locally at game days.

However, the changeover to 4th had them try to write their own system and they really did NOT have the mathematics background to make the system truly work (they were treating a 2d10 action check as if it had the same probability curve as a 1d20 check and ended up eventually borrowing MY probability calculations after the fact). It was because of this bad math and some badly written rules that caused characters to be taken out of entire 45-60 minute battles due to a single bad die roll that I gave up on Arcanis (great fluff... lousy system) and with it, my need to blow a coue hundred bucks on attending Origins every year.

One of these days I might have to try converting some of their better adventures over to 4E just for the heck of it.
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